EVs are basically a toy for well-off people who can charge at home. For everyone else, there's no logical reason to buy one, unless you're a confirmed masochist.
@lauren Premise 1: you are correct that a substantial portion of the population can’t use EVs because they can’t rationally charge them.
Premise 2: universal adoption of EVs would significantly help with climate change, air pollution, etc.
Question: what should be done, other than bemoaning Premise 1? (N.B. I’m reasonably well off but cannot rationally charge an EV, so I don’t have one. I regard that as a problem, since I also accept Premise 2.)
@SteveBellovin @lauren The time to fill a gasoline vehicle with 250 mi of gas is of the order of 10-15 min. Along with time spent to get to the gas station and waiting in line get you to about 1/2 hour to get fuel for a decent range. Any combination of technologies that would get that to an EV owner who doesn't have a home charger would make the difference. 1/2
@lou @SteveBellovin Most people get gas while on other trips, and the stations are pretty much everywhere in urban and suburban areas. Very little extra time involved, you pass them on pretty much every trip. Usually they pull into stations with open pumps. 10 minutes is pretty much max for a full tank. Chargers are hard to find, overpriced, often don't work at all, often have complex, incompatible payment systems, and usually aren't even designed to promote orderly queuing. There is just no upside unless one has the money and inclination to play climate hero. Most people don't.
@lauren @SteveBellovin Apparenly you have not waited in line at a Costco gas station.
> I don't do Costco.
Heh, if you drive a gas powered vehicle, **just the gas** at CostCo will pay for the membership.
A better question for you Lauren which is this; On days when you have started the day with a full tank of gas, how many of those days did you stop at a station?
EV owners, with chargers at home, start EVERY day with a full tank and so 'finding a charger' is not something they do except for long trips.
@ChuckMcManis @lou @SteveBellovin I've done the calculations. At the rates I pay for electricity -- and it's a 24/7 rate, no time of day discounts -- it would be about 2 to 3 times more expensive than gasoline. The other expenses related to ICE are minimal given my situation. And with a transition in many areas to heat pumps that will need even more electricity, it's a bad situation and getting worse. Right now it's 100F outside. More electricity being sucked by the minute. It's been that way all summer, or worse. Another big electricity expense I do not need, especially with more rate increases coming.
@lauren @lou @SteveBellovin That's fair. I was just pointing out the whole 'chargers are so hard to find' narrative doesn't really take into account the experience that EV owners have.
I'm looking to boost my solar generation capacity such that I can get completely off of PG&E's grid since they just axed my rate plan.
@ChuckMcManis @lou @SteveBellovin Most of the EV owners I know around here tell me that half the chargers they find don't work, and NEVER are fixed. They go from charge location to charge location to try find working ones. It's nuts.
@ChuckMcManis @lou @SteveBellovin As you presumably know the home solar market in California is in deep collapse right now.
Precisely because the PUC has made it uneconomical. I've asked both my state senator and assemblyperson to escalate problem in Sacremento. We can't be the "let's be green" state if we are also beholding to keeping PG&E profitable enough to pay off the people whose towns they have burned to the ground.
@ChuckMcManis @lou @SteveBellovin I object to my rates being pushed upward thanks to people well-heeled enough to have home solar. And that's what was happening. Even putting aside how much of the home solar industry has been pretty shady from day one. A lot of people burned. No puns intended, of course.
Curious if you read the PUC meeting minutes? Rates going up over the last 5 years have been a combination of large payouts for damages that aren't covered by insurance and the requirement by said insurance to do deferred maintenance on the grid infrastructure.
@ChuckMcManis @lou @SteveBellovin Crowded big box stores many miles away I don't need. Awful.
@lou @SteveBellovin I don't do Costco. There are plenty of gas stations with open pumps everywhere.